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Jayne Ellegard on Women and Money

May 19, 2021
 

Season 2, Episode 20

Summary:

What gets in your way of talking about money? Was it the way you were brought up? Is it a chore to understand investments? Don’t know how to get money to work for you? How about YES to all of the above? Jayne Ellegard, Founder and Coach at Elegant Wealth, is determined to make it easier for women to talk about and understand money. Early in her career, she stumbled into managing wealth for others and in her examination of her own thoughts and beliefs about money, she understood on a different level what influences our relationship with money and building wealth. Jayne is a Women and Wealth coach, money confidence creator, engaging speaker and the author of her new book “Financial Empowerment for Women: Your Guide to Courage, Confidence, and Wisdom!” In this episode shares why we struggle to talk about money, why we need to understand how money works, and how to get ahold of our finances regardless of where we’re starting from with her six pillars to financial empowerment.

 

Links:

Jayne Ellegard

Ellegant Wealth

Financial Empowerment for Women: Your Guide to Courage, Confidence and Wisdom

Michaelwkithcart.com

Champions of RISK

Instagram: jayne_ellegard

 

Transcript:

Michael Kithcart: 

Hello, I'm Michael Kithcart. I'm a high performance leadership coach and entrepreneur who helps worn out achievers move from exhausted to unstoppable by winning their way. Welcome to the Champions of RISK Podcast, where we examine the many aspects of risks so we can all face uncertainty with more strength, courage, and some humor together. So who doesn't want more money and the freedom that it can provide? Nearly everyone, I mean, everyone that I know does. So we want it, but almost all of us avoid talking about money. So today, what are we going to do? We are going to talk about money money money, money! Yes. So we're going to talk about it with our guest. If you are stressed out about money if you wish you knew more about it. If you want financial security, or you just want to build your wealth, this is the episode for you. My guest today is Jayne Ellegard. She empowers women to show up and own their own financial journey with courage, confidence and wisdom. After 34 years of managing wealth for high net worth individuals and wealthy families across the United States, Jayne made the leap to entrepreneurship. She's uniquely qualified with real experience and a variety of certifications and credentials. But even more importantly, she has an intense passion for providing women with a way to learn about money. That's enjoyable and fun. Yes, I said fun. Jayne has a brand new book out. It's called Financial Empowerment for Women, your guide to courage, confidence and wisdom. And so Jayne, welcome to the podcast.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Thank you so much, Michael, I'm thrilled to be here.

Michael Kithcart: 

I am so glad that you are willing to talk about money because we all have our own issues with it. Give us a little bit of context and tell me about your personal journey with money. What did it look like?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Well, I didn't grow up with a lot of money. So my dad was always telling me to marry a rich man. So that was his that was his advice that I got, that was great. He also told me to go into sales, because there was money to be had in sales. So the impression I walked away with was that money must be good. And I I must want more of it. So that was kind of the message that I heard. And when I started, you know, my first job right out of college, I had no money, I had student loans. And I was barely making, you know, paying the bills. So I, you know, I had to make it, I had to make it on my own. And I did. And I was just convinced that I was going to be successful and make it all work. And I didn't really ever meet the rich man. But it worked out pretty well. I met a really wonderful man. And we've done we've done fine. So it's been a good ride.

Michael Kithcart: 

That is great. So you started out your career, how far into, how many jobs did you have, before you decided that you were going to become a financial wealth advisor?

Jayne Ellegard: 

I didn't really decide that I was going to become a financial- it kind of found me to be perfectly honest. So I was in my second job at Cargill Incorporated in their corporate Treasury group. And I wanted to go back and get my master's, my MBA. So I was in the MBA program. And I was about halfway through. And one of the students that I had met worked for the Cargill Macmillan family directly and their family office. And he had been a student in some of the classes with me. And when they had an opening as a, you know, an investment for an investment person in the family office, he reached out to me and said, Hey, Jayne, you know, we'd love to have somebody from Cargill, you know, come work in the family office. And he said, I've been so impressed with you in during the classes at St. Thomas. He said, Do you want to come interview for the position? And I said, Sure. So it really wasn't intentional. It was very accidental. But I feel so incredibly fortunate that I had that opportunity. And that was really the start of my investment career working for one of the wealthiest families in the United States. So you know, and oddly enough, I didn't feel that You know, any trepidation about doing that, so I just jumped right in. And there I was, and it was just a really fantastic experience.

Michael Kithcart: 

Okay, so you got a look into one of the wealthiest families, right? And you've worked with other, you've helped build wealth for lots of other families in your career, what would you say is one of the big biggest differences between wealthy people, and those that struggle paycheck to paycheck?

Jayne Ellegard: 

I think it's the planning. You know, I think that wealthy people have everything planned out, they spend the time really thinking about money, and planning their money and planning their future. So that would be one of the biggest differences. And I know, it seems hard to comprehend that when you don't have money, and you're living paycheck to paycheck to paycheck that you should be planning and thinking ahead. But really, it's the best thing that you can possibly do, is really getting your arms around your financial situation and what it looks like, and how you can make steps forward. Because you really can. I mean, we spend money on things that are priorities to us. We always seem to find money for a cell phone, and for Netflix, and for dinner, not to be cliche, but that latte, at Caribou or Starbucks, we managed to find money for the things that are important to us, and that we want to have money for. And yet, if we could just take a step back, and spend a little bit of time really thinking about how we're spending our money, and how it could be better utilized, it would make a big difference.

Michael Kithcart: 

Okay. That sounds easy in theory, and then... and yet.

Jayne Ellegard: 

It's not, it's not, I'm not, you know, by no means am I saying this is easy. It's not easy. It's hard. But, you know, we all know how to do hard things. And we have to do hard things in our lives of who really want to have the outcome that we want to have. And so this is no different from anything else.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yes. And so for as hard as it is, it also doesn't have to be as hard as what we make it in our heads.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Exactly. And again, money mindset is such an important thing, and we get thrown off by it, we we think, Oh my gosh, it's, it's so complicated. And it's, it's, or it's really boring, or, you know, I mean, I hear all, all the different, you know, ways that people, you know, don't want to face their financial situations, or it's just, it's one of those things that it's not a priority that we want to say we don't want to spend time on this. And so we don't prioritize it. And we don't spend the time on it, we just keep pushing it to the side, or it falls to the bottom of the pile. And yet we have to actually face it, and just hit it head on.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, because the inactivity around it, the refusal to address the whatever situation that we're in, or if we want to make it better, that that anxiety that we produce, like self produced anxiety contributes to a high percentage, you know, maybe not a fully researched number, but a high percentage, right, of the, the the emotions that we have attached around money?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Well, we do. And the other piece of it is that, you know, money creates so much friction in a marriage, and in relationships, because we both heard different messages growing up, you know, like I said, I heard, you know, money was good. So I wanted to create more of that. And so I was very driven in my career. And yet people who may have heard the exact opposite, you know, that money was bad, or rich people are greedy, or evil, even, they're going to come at money from a very different perspective on when two people like that come together and get married. That causes friction, because you're both approaching it very, very differently. And you don't really ever step back and say, Well, why do you feel this way about money? And why am I feeling this way about money? So one of the things that I really encourage both of my classes and in my book is, is to have that conversation, and just take the time and talk about what not when you're in the middle of a fight. Don't do it then. When you know, when you're just hanging out one night, you know, I know it sounds silly, but bring that topic up and talk about you know, the different messages that you heard growing up, and why you might approach money the way that you do and start to understand why your why you have the emotions that you do around it. And why they have emotions they do around it.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, that's really good advice. Maybe add wine?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Yeah, with everything, add wine.

Michael Kithcart: 

And so then if we're gonna dissect it a little bit more, because your book is specifically does talk to women, because women do have a harder time talking about money for some reason. Why do you think it feels so risky to us as women to talk about money?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Well, again, we were brought up that that wasn't polite to talk about. It was funny, I had a woman who was in one of my classes, she said, we were told- she grew up in a ranching community. And she said, You never asked someone how many head of steer they have, because then you would know how much money what they were worth. And I think we've just we've been brought up to believe that it's, you know, it's gauche, it's impolite, you don't do that. And so we've not talked about it, and yet, it's holding us back, it's holding us back. You know, in the corporate world, we didn't talk about it, and therefore we weren't as well equipped as men who shared salary amounts. So they could go into a salary negotiation, knowing what other people were getting paid. Whereas as women, we always went in blind. And so we didn't know what we could or should be asking for. And so I think that's part of the reason why we're still being paid what 82 or 84 cents on the dollar, is because we aren't sharing with one another. And so we really need to start opening up about this.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yes, yes. And having conversations with each other, being okay too, if there's a big gap between the way that one person is seeing it, and the other if we could just get to the point where we're viewing it as information. And if there's a collective understanding that we're all there to help each other.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Yes, exactly. And that's, that is how we need to start approaching it. And in, in our businesses, you know, so many of us are becoming business owners and entrepreneurs, because we haven't been treated fairly in corporate America, or we want more flexibility, or there's something that we want, as entrepreneurs that we can't get in the corporate world. And as we move into those roles, we also need to start talking to each other and opening up about what we're charging our clients and, and how we're getting paid. And, you know, we're how we're working with corporations, how they're paying us and how we're getting into those, we need to start sharing the secrets and supporting one another. And I, I hear some lip service to that, but I'm not always seeing that actually carried out. I mean, I know I've had a tremendous amount of support and encouragement from women, other women entrepreneurs, but there's still, there's still a little bit of, you know, I don't quite want to share everything, or, you know, right next step. And so I think we really have to start helping each other.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yes, that's scarcity mentality. And it shows up in so many different ways. And I've had other episodes with guests where we've talked about this is like, because we, I think some of it stems from we are the only ones that we've seen in the room, sometimes in our corporate environment. So we think if it's not us, it can't be you know, it's gonna be somebody else, instead of expanding it and including more, the biggest thing that I see in entrepreneurship, that is a huge opportunity. And I'm trying to figure this out, too, as men are so good about helping each other, grow their businesses, everything from affiliate programs. So let me you know, let me bring you in, we'll do this together, you get your cut, I get my cut, you know, and I'm not we're not doing that at the same level as women entrepreneurs. And I am, I want to change that, and you're going to help us change.

Jayne Ellegard: 

I definitely want to see I can change. And I think, you know, I think a big part of that is and I've heard this from a lot of the women who have gone through my course, is once they actually understand their own personal financial situation, you realize how much more that you can do. I've seen that a lot. With regards to charitable contributions. I've had a lot of the women say, Oh my gosh, now that I actually understand my situation, I realize I can be even more charitable than I have been. Because now I get it, I see what we actually have. But when you're kind of in the dark, you don't really know. And I think that's the same thing with with entrepreneurs. We're still playing a little bit in the dark when it comes to our finances. And so we all need to learn, you know, not only the financial situation of our company, but Our personal financial situation, and how much more we can do for one another.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, yeah, great point. Well, let's talk a little bit about your book Financial Empowerment for Women. And in it, you provide six pillars to financial empowerment, which I think relates to everything right? If you're in a corporate life if you're in an entrepreneurial situation, so give us a quick rundown on each of the pillars, please.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Yeah, absolutely. So pillar one is explore your money beliefs. And that was what I was talking about earlier. And that's where I share the stories about my dad's great advice. And, you know, but talking about, again, getting through some of those limiting beliefs that you might have around money, and just making small steps. And first, it's being aware, right? I mean, first and foremost, you have to have that awareness that you do have a limiting belief. And I think for a lot of women, I one that I've heard from, you know, a number of clients, is the belief that, you know, my brain doesn't do money, or math or numbers. And, and so we've ruled it out, we've decided that we can't do it. And we really haven't even given ourselves a chance. And like I said, truly, financial management isn't rocket science, it really isn't. So every woman that I know, is plenty smart enough to understand this. But it's, you know, I think part of it is that, you know, the industry, the financial services industry has been very male dominated, very masculine. It was really an industry built by men for men. And so I think a lot of the terminology and a lot of the lingo that gets used is very masculine. And so it's not very inviting and welcoming to women. And so I think we've kind of looked at it and said, Oh, you know, it just doesn't even sound interesting. Why would I want to learn about that. And so we've just kind of pushed it aside. And yet, eight out of 10 women will end up on this journey alone. Whether they never marry they divorced, or they're widowed. At some point, most women will have to step up and take responsibility for their financial situation. So and that's the whole reason I started this business was because I saw what happened to women who hadn't been engaged in the financial conversation, when their spouse died, or they were divorced, suddenly, they were divorced. And now they were forced into understanding it, and it felt scary and overwhelming. And so that was the entire reason why I started this and wanted to focus on women was because I saw it happening over and over again.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah. I still I and I think there's another there's another piece in there. Okay, so everything that you're saying, I absolutely agree with you. And then there's also women who do generate a lot of money, you know, like, I just look at my my network of women friends, and if they aren't out earn earning their spouse or their partner right now, they did at some point in their career, like, I can't think of anybody that's in my circle that hasn't out earned the man. And so and yet, we still get nervous talking about investments, and, you know, other aspects of, of business. And, you know, I have a friend who absolutely believes in controlling all of her own investments. And her message to us is, why in the world, would you let some middle aged white man make your investments for you? Like, there's no relatability? There, period, exclamation point, take control of your investments? Like, I think and she says it with that tone.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Well, again, it has been a very male dominated, I mean, there's still only have certified financial planners, only 23% are women.

Michael Kithcart: 

So we need to change that.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Exactly. And yet, most, most women, as they do become the one who is responsible for their finances, would prefer to have a female financial advisor. So but yet we just we aren't. We aren't inviting women into that career path. And yet, I don't understand why, Michael, because quite honestly, women are naturally talented at what it takes to be a really great financial advisor because think about it. When I was hiring advisors. I was looking for people who had great communication skills. I wanted them to be able to be good listeners and hear what their clients were saying. And to be able to communicate the concepts at whatever level the client is at. And to be able to build strong client relationships, and create trust and have compassion, have things that women are so good at. And yet women are not flocking to this field.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yes. Okay. So there's a huge opportunity there. Right? Before we move on to pillar two, because within pillar one, right, you talked about you talk about, you know, what your your relationship with money was growing up, what were those messages that you heard, and I'm just curious about your kind of your take on this, because in the K 12 system, you know, there really isn't financial education, there's starting to be a little bit now I get so excited anytime I hear a high schooler who says that they're doing this, but certainly in our generations, and they're just nothing. So we weren't taught how to balance our statements or way back in the day a checkbook or, you know, any of those kinds of things. So where are we supposed to get our financial literacy? And how could public schools or just K through 12 help in that?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Yeah, I wish I had a great answer for that, Michael. And it's, it's sadly lacking. I mean, there really is very little happening in K through 12. And so really, it's, it's only happening if you're fortunate enough to have a parent, who happens to understand this well, and understands how important that is to educate their children. You know, I was on a call with the women's group a couple months ago, I think it was, and one of the women asked, she said, you know, how can we help our daughters become, you know, educated in this area? And I said, Well, first and foremost, you need to be a good role model. And right now, a lot of women aren't being good role models for their daughters. So I said, Bring this topic up at the dinner table, when everybody's there and start learning about it yourself, and getting engaged in the meetings with your financial adviser, even if it is an old white guy, get engaged, be there and be part of the conversation I had another woman told me the other day that, you know, she was busy building this huge career and do it, you know, she was so busy with, her husband was going to the meetings with a financial adviser. And then she said she got involved again and realized that the deferred comp that they had, for their family was nowhere even close to covering what she was now making. So it had not kept up. And so that was a huge is something that happened to her, that would have been a huge detriment to her family. But she said, You know, I wasn't engaging, like I should have been. And so you know, your situation better than anybody else. So if you're not involved in the conversation, things may not be happening. That should be.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, I love that modeling the behavior, modeling the behavior you want to see, and others and lead by example. I love that. In regards to that, you know, money can feel risky to a lot of us. And so how do you build risk tolerance, when it comes to investments, money? Any any aspect of that?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Well, again, a big part of is understanding it. You know, one of the pillars of pillar five is all about investments. And I probably spend the book in the book, the largest chapter is probably double the size of any other chapter in the book. And that's very intentional, because, you know, I wanted, I wanted women to get pulled in and drawn in with the other chapters, and then really focus on the investments because that, to me, is where we really need to learn. Because I think for so many of us, it feels like when you do sit down with a financial advisor, it feels like they're speaking a foreign language. And when you when they start talking, and you don't understand one or two of the concepts that they're that they're saying that they're using, you're going to shut down. You know, it's like when I go to meet with a doctor, and they start using terminology that I don't get, I shut down. I don't put that I have to go home and research it. Because it's important to me to understand it if it's about my own health. But if somebody's sitting in a meeting with a financial advisor, and they get lost in the conversation, and they don't ask any questions and then they don't go home and research it. It just kind of compounds on itself. And in so at some point, you do have to take on the responsibility of wanting to learn more. But you're never going to take on risk when you don't understand what the stock market does and how it works. And so I just really keep coming back to the education. And that's, that's why it's so important to me that, you know, I try to provide this and deliver this to women is because, you know, money does so many good things. And you know, I said earlier, I'm a lot of people were brought up to believe that money is bad. And yet, you know, money provides financial security, it provides financial freedom, it provides flexibility, it provides choices, it provides you a way to make a difference with anything with regarding social justice, that might be important to you, or any other, you know, things like that, that, you know, you want to make a difference or make an impact on. And so money is good. And we need to grow our wealth and just saving, you know, if you save up, if you had a million dollars today, and you put it in a savings account for the next 20 years, you'll have a little over a million dollars, but your purchasing power will be more like around 600,000. Because inflation will have eroded away, you know, so you will have lost money, in essence, by just putting it in a savings account. Now, if you take that million dollars, and you invest it, and you you get a return, let's say 10%. And that's a pretty aggressive investment. But you get a 10% return over that 20 years, you'll have a little over $6 million, and your purchasing power will be I think around 3.8 million. So that is the difference between saving and growing your wealth.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah. love that distinction.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Women have got to get past that, holding them back.

Michael Kithcart: 

Mm hmm. I love that. Okay, so I made you jump to pillar five. So we'll go back. So pillar one was explore your money beliefs.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Yep.

Michael Kithcart: 

And pillar two is:

Jayne Ellegard: 

Establish your financial goals. So what I want women to think about there, it's like anything, right? I mean, you need to look forward and know where you're trying to get to in order to arrive there. And I want women to think about what it is they want to achieve with their wealth. You know, what is it that's important to them? What, you know, what are those dreams, those goals that they want to achieve? And so thinking about that, so that's really looking at the pillar to the financial goals. And then pillar three-

Michael Kithcart: 

Okay, wait wait, before you go to pillar three, because, you know, because I did read the book. And, and I will just let me just put a little plug here. Jayne does a beautiful job at really simplifying things, getting you to think in a different way. And she puts money in perspective, and has great quotes from powerful women in there. And so I just I really enjoy the book a lot. It's one like, I keep going back to I have not done all of the exercises yet.

Jayne Ellegard: 

You do it over time.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yes, yes. But one of the things is I really loved Maslow Meets Retirement. That was really great to tell everyone about the we can't see the diagram because we're doing audio here. But how can we apply Maslow meets retirement?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Well, you know, I think we're all familiar with Maslow's hierarchy, and you start out you know, when you have your, your covering your basic needs, and then you gradually move up until you you know, hopefully hit the pinnacle. And, and you've you've achieved, you know, your, your, your top passion, your goal, and how the Maslow's meets retirement needs. It's very similar. I mean, it starts out with, you know, I mean, I started out, you know, myself with, you know, barely, maybe being able to, you know, pay my bills and cover utilities and the basic needs, right, your groceries. And so it's, it's very similar, it's, you know, where are you at on that, and then the next level is kind of more about, you know, safety and so it's, you know, do you have insurance, because that's really important for us to have in our financial lives because, you know, something happening like a car accident or a fire burning down your home. I mean, that could wipe you out if you didn't have insurance. And so, you know, making sure that you have the appropriate insurance in place is kind of that next step. And then you go from there you go from to your freedom, money, and so your freedom money is really looking at it. You know, things like I can I say, you know, for my husband and I, we were able to go buy a cabin, in our we're able to do some traveling, you know, those are some where you kind of start to have a little bit of money where you can do fun things, right. So it kind of expands your world a little bit. And then we go from there to gift money. And so gift money is, you know, like, we were able to, you know, help our son with his college education and with a down payment on a home. And we're also able to give to charities that are close to our hearts. And, and then you hit the top, and that's your dream money. And that's, you know, for me, that was starting my own business and being able to follow my passion. And so, you know, thinking about where you fall on that spectrum, very similar to you know, the Maslow's hierarchy. And so, I think just doing that comparison, and again, it's it's figuring out, again, what what is that dream money for you? And your dream money could you know, that could be very different picture than than it is for me. And I had other women say also that, you know, they didn't feel like it was a straight line, right? It wasn't linear for them, they bounced around you, maybe they got divorced. And so that threw them into her that they lost their spouse, or, you know, and so it wasn't quite as quite as linear as it was for me. So, so it's different for everybody. But I think just laying that out for yourself, and stopping to think about it helps you again, think about where you want to be in the future.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yep. Absolutely. That's great. Thank you. Okay, pillar number three.

Jayne Ellegard: 

All right, so this one, Know your net worth. And I, you know, to me, your net worth is such an important number to know. And yet, I think there are so many people who don't, and it's not just women, there are a lot of people that don't know what their net worth is. And this, to me is really your financial starting point. It's, it's kind of your gauge or your benchmark of where am I today. And again, when you think about your, like, when you go to buy a plane ticket, you you need to know not only your destination, or where you're going, but you also need to know your starting point. And so you know, pillar two, we talk about kind of the destination, and then I kind of take a step back and in pillar three and say okay, but you also need to know where you're at right now. And this is a number, you know, it's your assets, you know, everything that you own your house, your cars, investment accounts, retirement accounts, your savings accounts, everything that you own is your assets. And then you have your liabilities and your liabilities, all the money that you owe, so your mortgage, or if you have a car loans, student loans, anything like that, to take your assets minus your liabilities. And that's your net worth. And, you know, Michael, I would have women in my class, say, Jayne, this is this is not going to be pretty, it's going to be a negative number. And what that's okay, that's okay, if that's where you're at today, that is okay, but write it down. And, and then figure out how you're going to move forward from there. So use this as an opportunity to really propel you forward into really push you into thinking about how you can get that up into a positive number, you know, and then continue to grow it. So use it as that benchmark or gauge to really to really, you know, make it more than where it is today.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, you give, just hearing that, and you say that I can imagine like being in your workshop, and just, there's no judging in this, right? It's just information, it's just their data points. And that can inform everyone on what's the next best step to take. See, it's like I can feel you removing the emotion from the equation. And that has to be so helpful.

Jayne Ellegard: 

The other thing that I share with women is it your net worth is a financial number. And it has absolutely nothing to do with your self worth. And I don't ever want women to mix that up because you as a as a person bring so much to the world. And and that's there's so many things that are special about you. And so don't don't let whatever your net worth is that is just a financial number. And it really has nothing to do with with you and and the wonderful person that you are.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, good. Love that message. powerful message. Okay, next pillar.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Alright, so next pillar is Spend with purpose. And I like to say that I don't like the B word, budget. I know what you thought I was gonna say!

Michael Kithcart: 

Yes, I did. (laughing) And we don't edit those parts out.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Okay, well, nope, it's budget. I think budget sounds like punishment. And who wants to go on a budget? I compared to diet?

Michael Kithcart: 

Boo, hiss!

Jayne Ellegard: 

Oh, who wants to go on a diet and who wants to go on a budget? And I know I told my husband that early on, I will not go on a budget. So the way that I talk about spending with purpose is treasures, promises and joy. So tomorrow's treasures, what are you saving for the future? Your past promises, what have you already committed to? So you know, your mortgage payments, your car payment, utilities, those are the things that you have to have. And then whatever's left over is for today's joy. And so I think just putting it into different terminology, and making it not feel like, you know, I've failed, because so oftentimes, people set up budgets, and, you know, for people who can have a budget and can do that successfully. God bless you. I mean, that is wonderful. I just more I have found that most people are not successful. And so then they feel like they've failed. And so then they're beating themselves up. And so I just, I just wanted to move people away from that mindset of, you know, not feeling good about themselves. Yeah, give them a different way to view the end, because you do have to understand what you're spending, right. I mean, you do have to understand this aspect of your financial situation. But it doesn't have to be as ugly and painful as I think the industry has made it.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah. And what your association with it is again, right. So I love what you did out of there as you took away trigger words for people, when the budget doesn't hold any, you know, it doesn't cause a reaction and you find great, just do the budget, but if it does, call it something else, then. And so you help people do that. And then you talked a little bit about the fifth pillar, but go ahead and put it in context. So we see the whole picture here.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Yeah, so pillar five is Learn to speak investments. And again, there's just so much lingo and jargon that takes place. And so people do feel like we're speaking a foreign language. And so I wanted to really cut through that. And I wanted to give a lot of analogies. So one of my favorite analogies is what I called the perfect outfit. And it's hard to explain without seeing the picture, because the picture is so much fun. But it talks about stocks being your top, and then your bonds or fixed income portion of your portfolios is your bottoms, your pants, and those kind of the cover your butt portion of your portfolio. Right and so I talk about risk, but you know, it is the more stable portion of your portfolio. And then we have your purse, and you carry your cash in your purse, and everybody should have some emergency fund cash right to have. And then your shoes is your real estate, and it's a high rise or flat

Michael Kithcart: 

(laughing)

Jayne Ellegard: 

I wish you could see me, But yeah, the high rise or flat, and, and then we've got the commodities portion of your portfolio is kind of your bling, your jewelry, it's gold, silver, you know, so that's makes up commodities. And so, and we spend a lot of time explaining why each of those components in a portfolio is important, or what they do in the portfolio, if you have those pieces in it. And so you but helping, you know, I think what happens too is, you've been meeting with your financial advisor for the last 10 years. And they've been talking about stocks and bonds and asset allocation and diversification. And you haven't understood a word they've said, and now you're 10 years in with them. And it's really hard to now say, you know, Joe, I really don't even understand the difference between a stock and a bond. Because we feel like we should, yeah, right. We feel like we should, because where are we supposed to learn this. And so, giving women a way to connect the dots, when they're sitting down with their advisor, their planner, their spouse, their partner, their father, their whoever it is that they're talking to, about their financial situation. If they can start to understand some of those basic concepts, they're going to get more engaged in the conversation. And again, you know your situation better than anyone else. And so if you're not engaging in that conversation today, There's somebody else is making decisions about your financial future for you.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yes, without your best interest at heart, and it's not that they're doing things against you, but nobody's gonna care about it more than you.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Exactly. Exactly.

Michael Kithcart: 

That reason enough is why we should.

Jayne Ellegard: 

You know one of the analogies I use, as I say, you know, would you allow someone to go buy groceries for your family for the next week? with almost no input from you?

Michael Kithcart: 

Okay, well, I hate to say my first response was like, Yeah, go ahead. So therein, I just like, I'm demonstrating the problem right there.

Jayne Ellegard: 

But yeah, I mean, most, most people would say no, because, you know, somebody else might come back with sugary cereals, you'd never feed your family vegetables, your family won't eat, you know, I don't eat gluten, they might go, you know, they come back with bread that I couldn't even touch. So, but we're oftentimes willing to let somebody else make decisions about our financial future with very little input from us.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, such a great point. It really is. It's more powerful point than it sounds, because I contradicted it, but, Jayne, everybody. Okay, and then the sixth pillar.

Jayne Ellegard: 

And then the sixth pillar is Protect and Plan. And that's really about insurance and estate planning. And insurance is a really important component of our overall, you know, financial situation. And so, and I think it's something that gets overlooked or it's, it's just something we don't want to think about the analogy that I shared in the book is, it's kind of like, you know, when you stop at the hardware store to buy a toilet plunger, you know, you're not excited to use the toilet. Right, you're hoping you never actually have to use it. But if you need it, you're really happy that it's there. And insurance is the same thing. And so it is something that you do really want to pay attention to. And then estate planning is one of those things that again, we hate to think about, because it's thinking about our own death. And we don't like to talk about that. And we don't want to think that that's going to happen. And yet, what I share with with women is don't send your family on a scavenger hunt, at the time of your death, because that's what you'll be doing. if things aren't well planned, and things aren't laid out, and people don't know where to find things. And you're not organized with everything. It's painful enough when you lose a loved one. But when you lose a loved one, and then you have absolutely no idea where anything is at or what's supposed to happen. It's even worse.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, yes. And if we haven't directly gone through that experience ourselves, we know, people who have through parents through spouses, and it's just nothing- and everybody says the same thing: I wouldn't wish this on anyone.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Exactly.

Michael Kithcart: 

And we can do something about it now.

Jayne Ellegard: 

We can and so please do. And then what I wrap it all up with, Michael, is what I call your heartfelt legacy. And I think it's really important for women to think about legacy. And I think women are often very charitably inclined. And so that is something that's important to us. But I also want all of us to understand that it's not just about what happens to your money after you die. Your legacy is about so much more than that. Your legacy is about who you are today, while you're living, you know, the what you're sharing with your family that the gifts that you're giving to charities while you're alive and well. And like yes, I don't even just mean money. I mean, your time, your talents. You know, there's so much more that we can give too, what's important to us today while we're here. So it doesn't necessarily just have to be about what happens when we're gone.

Michael Kithcart: 

Yeah, that's a great point. Yet again, things that we can do right now. That will make a difference. So, you know, give us a little bit of hope here, Jayne, and you did sprinkle it throughout. But no matter where anyone is right now on their on their money journey. What can we accomplish by better handling our finances today?

Jayne Ellegard: 

Well, and I always say and it's in the book too. It's never too early to start thinking about this and it's never too late. So regardless of where you're at in your journey, you know, don't look back, don't beat yourself up for what you wish you would have done. What you could have done, just look forward and start making decisions today, to change what you may need to change or to figure out how to take steps toward what it is you truly want to achieve. So, so don't beat yourself up, just look forward. And we can all do it, you can make small changes come up with just really tiny things that might be as small as, you know, cutting out that, you know, subscription that you haven't used in, in two years, that you're paying $10 a month, you know, and start tucking that $10 away somewhere into an emergency fund or starting to invest or, you know, so make it small steps. But I think the biggest thing is really just learning more about the concepts, and getting engaged in the conversation in any way that you can.

Michael Kithcart: 

Now educate yourself. That's great. Well, and one way that you can do that is pick up Jayne's book Financial Empowerment for Women your guide to courage confidence and wisdom. Jayn , thank you so much for being n the podcast. How can people fi d you and follow yo

Jayne Ellegard: 

Oh, thank you so much. Yes, www.ellegantweath.com. And ellegant is spelled with two L's, like my la t name Ellegard. So, so it's a little tricky, but you can find m out there. But I offer a variety of different courses. A d now of course, have the book a d so in would love to have a conversation. There's a let's connect button on there. So if y u have any questions or want t chat with me about what might b the right path for you, p ease reach out. I love talking a out this.

Michael Kithcart: 

Well, and you're really good at it. So again, thank you for taking time and sharing your message with the Champions of RISK podcast audience. Appreciate it.

Jayne Ellegard: 

Thanks so much for having me, Michael. I loved it.

Michael Kithcart: 

And hey, thank you for listening to this podcast. If you found value in his episode, please share it. That way we can all help more people. We want to spread the messages of our great guests just like Jayne. And I would really, really appreciate it if you would just go and take 30 seconds nd go to iTunes and subscribe t the Champions of RISK podcast a d even take one more second and rate it, that would be so helpful. It actually does make a difference and that way I'm ab e to elevate the voices of more nd we can be spreading these gr at messages that our guests to more people. And if you would like to follow me on Instagram and get more insights and more podcast guests. You can follow me on Instagram @MichaelKithcart

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